[poll] Names!

[pne]

To clarify slightly (hopefully): the "more than two middle names" was meant to read "more than two given names (i.e., more than one middle name)". And the "human" option is for those who would prefer to answer neither "male" nor "female"; I take it for granted that most people who chose "male" or "female" also consider themselves "human".

[Poll #482803] [Poll #482804]

Comments

[kutsuwamushi.livejournal.com]

I don't know if I'll change my last name or not when I get married. If I wasn't the only one in my family with my last name now (my mom married and took her husband's name, my father has no contact whatsoever with my family), I would definitely change it if my spouse's name was cooler. =) Now I'm not so sure.

[blackfyr.livejournal.com]

The other term I use for my last name is my patronym.

[ladyortyger.livejournal.com]

Not sure if I'd change my name when marrying or not, but I'd at least think about it if my partner had a strong preference. Otherwise, I lean towards no. However, children would have the last name of their father, which is least complicated.

My family has a strong trend of naming sons after their grandfather - my grandfather's name was Tzvi, my father's name is Israel, my brother's name is Tzvi.

Also, in my religion it is common to name a child after a deceased relative.

[leora.livejournal.com]

Apparently my parents found that some of the grandparents came from a tradition where naming after deceased relatives is common and others from one that named after living relatives. Both found the opposite tradition distasteful. As a fifth child, they'd already run out of people they felt a need to name people after by the time I came along though.

[volantwish]

i don't know whether i will change my name if/when i marry. a lot would depend upon the gender of my spouse; i would be more likely to take a male spouse's last name but to change to a combined last name with a female spouse. although, my mom keeps her maiden name, and i may end up doing that too because i admire her.

...it would also depend on my spouse's last name. if taking it would make my full name alliterative, it's out :)

[pne.livejournal.com]

a lot would depend upon the gender of my spouse

Ah; I hadn't considered that this would be a factor for some people, since I only ever considered one gender as possible spouses (spice?).

[volantwish]

spice!
*giggle*

"given name" in Germany

[pne.livejournal.com]

I haven't come across an equivalent of "given name" in Hungarian.

I don't think German really has a word for that, either; the common words I can think of are "Vorname" (forename) for given name and "Nachname" (aftername) or "Zuname" (byname, roughly, or additional name) for family name. You could also use "Familienname" for family name to disambiguate, but I can't think of a version for given name that unambiguously (i.e. without regard to position) means that.

Re: "given name" in Germany

[pthalo]

Does German have an equivalent of "Christian name"? if so, and if my German didn't suck, I'd probably end up using that. Or I'd go with Vorname and Nachname when talking about English or German names because that wouldn't confuse me. But if I had to talk about Hungarian names in German I'd want to avoid "first/last"

Re: "given name" in Germany

[pne.livejournal.com]

Does German have an equivalent of "Christian name"?

I can't think of one.

There's "Taufname" (baptismal name), I think, but I'm not sure exactly what it means -- whether it only refers to an additional (saint's) name that you receive at baptism, for example.

Ah! Looking "first name" up in dict.leo.org brings up "Rufname" (calling name, or name you call someone by), which I had forgotten about -- that should work unambiguously as "given name", at least for people who go by your first given name, as you do.

So, "Rufname" and "Familienname" should work.

Rufname

[pne.livejournal.com]

BTW, "Rufname" is also used to designate which of your given names you are called by, so someone whose birth certificate says "Johannes Erich Paul Kindt" and whose friends call him Paul would have have "Paul" as his "Rufname", even though it's not his first given name. (But it is a given name.)

[leora.livejournal.com]

Hi, Anything. :)

[pthalo]

Hi!

[leora.livejournal.com]

My names are complicated and my answers potentially misleading, so I'll explain.

The term I usually use for my first given name is my birth name. I was given a birth name including a first, middle, and last name. The last name is my father's family's name for some values of family name that include it was changed only a couple generations back during immigration to the US. Changed drastically.

Since I was 14, I've gone by my chosen name of Rachel. This is the name my father wished to give me, but my mother ended up getting her way as to what my name would be. I consider my full name to be Rachel, followed by my given names.

When I was 5 days old, I was given my Hebrew name in the temple. It is two names long, and my username Leora comes from that. It is as much my name as my English name, but I use it far less often. It isn't as legally recognized.

As far as I am aware, I would properly be addressed in Hebrew by my first given Hebrew name, a word that means daughter of, and then my mother's first given Hebrew name. I'm not positive about this. I know my brothers would have a similar pattern but with my father's given name and it would look like this David ben Mordecai - David son of Mordecai. Because of this, I said I am properly addressed with a matronymic.

I do not intend to ever marry, so I chose other for both of those.

Most people call me by either my chosen name, one of my regular online handles (such as Leora (which is also my name, but not all my online handles are), a nickname derived from one of those names/handles, or a nickname derived from something else. My mother calls me by my given first name, and she's allowed to. Other than that, it's usually a sign that it's some salesman or some legal matter. I can sort my life into official/junk versus personal based on the term of address, which is somewhat nice.

[pne.livejournal.com]

a word that means daughter of

"bat"/"bas", perhaps? IIRC "bat mitzvah"/"bas mitzvah" (depending on the pronunciation of Hebrew you use, I suppose) means "daughter of the covenant". And a google for "rachel bat shoshanah" (to pick names at random) brings up some hits that look as if this kind of name-pattern is not uncommon.

[leora.livejournal.com]

Could well be. I just didn't hear it used enough and wasn't certain, and figured it better to leave it out than get it wrong.

I do know some say Bat and some say Bas, and I'm not really clear on why. There are a lot of differences like that in Hebrew that I understand. For example, my Hebrew first name is either Deborah or Devorah. It's pretty much equally both, because the letter is bet/vet. Bet and Vet are either two different letters or one letter, depending on how you look at it. The only difference is a vowel marker (not really a vowel in this case, but the markers you put in when you're writing Hebrew with vowels). Since Hebrew is generally written without them bet and vet are interchangeable. So you can get b/v ... confusion... if confusion is the right word. They're just both right. You can get the same thing with pey/fey for a p/f sound. And shin/sin for sh/s sounds.

But I can't think of a t/s issue like that. So, it's kind of weird. But I really don't know a lot of Hebrew or the related culture of how it is used.

[pne.livejournal.com]

I do know some say Bat and some say Bas, and I'm not really clear on why.

I think this has to do with Jews in different parts of the world having evolved different pronunciations, sort of like British and American pronunciations (some say "cot" and "caught" the same, some distinguish between them, sort of thing). IIRC there're two main groups of pronunciation: Ashkenazic (originally from north-eastern Europe?) and Sephardic (originally from Spain?).

One of the differences was pronouncing the last letter of the alphabet as 's' or 't', hence 'shabbat' vs 'shabbos'; other differences concerned vowel sounds, for example.

I believe that for some reason, most people in Israel use one pronunciation and most Jews in America the other, hence two pronunciations for many things.

[missysedai.livejournal.com]

In regards to writing my name, if I'm forced to do so, it's typically my full legal name (Margaret Susanne Metzger-Brazeau). This is great fun for things like mortgage signings and the like.

[burr86.livejournal.com]

You can call me whatever you want, just don't call me late for dinner! ;)

[vittorio23.livejournal.com]

Funny enough, if people aren't calling me by my nickname then it is my first name along with my last name. It's wierd...

[timwi.livejournal.com]

Your last name is "wierd"? :-)

[jpallan.livejournal.com]

My name has the same initials as all of my siblings, save my sisters' since they got married, but that was my parents' intent. Don't ask me why.

I changed my name upon my first marriage to be Jessica Allan $husbandsname (Jessica A. $husbandsname), as opposed to Jessica Pamela Allan. I felt that was the best way to both honor my birth family and take my husband's name. I took his name at his insistence. When I began to initiate my divorce, I used the name Jessica Pamela Allan $husbandsname (Jessica P. Allan $husbandsname) as I felt that a good compromise (and in line with American etiquette -- a largely ignored rule is that the divorcée's proper title is Mrs. MaidenName MarriedName). During the divorce, I finally decided to take my maiden name back for a myriad of reasons.

It's easier to both pronounce and spell. It's shorter. It's my name and I never wanted to give it up anyway. And a very key consideration.

In the United States, custom is that all legitimate children (legitimate in this case being 'acknowledged by the father') are named with their father's last name as their last name. My daughters are Alicia $fathersname and Julianne $fathersname. [I only now just went back and edited all that, as this post is public.] Strangely, upon divorce and full custody to the mother, children tend to keep their father's name anyway.

Assuming I marry Mr. Schmidt, I will name his children with his last name. I don't want my older daughters to feel that they're being given more or less place in my life by my choice of name.

I intend to continue to use my maiden name professionally for the rest of my life. Rev. Allan, Dr. Allan, Miss Allan; but to use my married name socially, i.e. "Mr. and Mrs. Schmidt". :shrug: It works.

I also routinely use my former married name on correspondence to my daughters' schools and such, for the simple reason it's easier to match up the note signed Jessica $husbandsname than it is the note signed Jessica Allan. They are legally registered at school, as is required by law, with my legal name -- but I simply mention that I don't mind using my ex-husband's name for the purposes of correspondence, telephone calls, etc. and that makes life much easier for everyone.

[nik-w.livejournal.com]

My name has the same initials as all of my siblings, save my sisters' since they got married, but that was my parents' intent. Don't ask me why.

This reminds me of my next-door neighbours - all their names contain the letters "an": The parents are Ian & Anne, and the kids are called Andrew and Joanne. Whether this was intentional or not, I don't know, but I thought it was a curious occurance - especailly when Joanne started living with a guy called Andy (who she's now living with)...:D

[opal1159.livejournal.com]

Marriage is far too distant and unlikely to consider. :P

My mom writes her name in English as [phonetically-translated Chinese given name (like me)] [husband's/my dad's/my last name] and sometimes with her maiden initial as a middle initial, but she probably didn't do that until she came to the States after being married, so she never had an "English" name with her own last name on it to get used to already, whereas I couldn't see signing/writing/seeing a different full English name for myself.

In Chinese she is still [maiden name] [given name], but sometimes people in the Chinese community address her by [my dad's last name] tai tai or a yi. If they are calling her lao shi (she has taught in Chinese school), I've heard both last names used (not at the same time).

[bdot.livejournal.com]

my birth name was laura margaret mary mortimer
at age 10 i changed it to bronwyn llewellyn mortimer
(llewellyn is my mother's maiden name)
when i married the first time, i changed my last name to my husband's.
when i married the second time, i again changed my last name to his.

when i divorced my second husband, i changed my last name yet again to something completely unrelated to anything or anyone.

so basically, now i have a name (first middle and last) where i chose each name at various points in my life and none of my current names are names that my parents chose for me at birth....

but i am unusual that way!

[pne.livejournal.com]

I was rather surprised when I read the comment notification first, since it strips out newlines when it thinks something is "all one paragraph".

So I read "at age 10 I changed it to Bronwyn Llewellyn Mortimer when I married the first time, ..." and went o.O at the age. Then I figured out where the sentence divisions went :)

[bdot.livejournal.com]

LOL

punctuation is underrated some times!!!! maybe i should use more that just elipses and exclamation marks.... but i am stuck!

[me-and.livejournal.com]

I normally get called a whole variety of different things, depending on who it is. Normally my first name, or abbreviations on my surname. Some people call me semi-nicknames, namely "Lord {surname}" or "Mathematical {firstname}" (in jokes)

[timwi.livejournal.com]

Do you capitalise your family name? (e.g. John SMITH / NAKAMURA Chieko)

Only when writing French or Esperanto.

Which of the following do you have in your full name?

You forgot "an artist's pseudonym" :-) but I don't have one.

Would you expect your partner to change their family name when they marry you?

The answer "no" is ambiguous. It could mean "I do not expect my partner to...", or "I expect my partner not to...". The former applies to me, and I find the distinction quite important.

I consider myself

I hate it when the pollmakers put some joke answer in ("none of the above", in this case), and then people give that answer just to be funny, making the whole question much less interesting because the answers are not serious.

[pne.livejournal.com]

I hate it when the pollmakers put some joke answer in ("none of the above", in this case)

It wasn't intended to be a joke answer.

It's just that I thought that there'd be people who not only would not describe themselves as 'male' or 'female' but might not even identify as 'human'. It's not something I can imagine but in my time across LiveJournal I've come across a variety of beliefs which are different from anything I'd come across before, and people appear to be sincere in that belief.

So if someone thinks they're really, say, a reincarnated wolf or an alien from Alpha Centauri, or perhaps nineteen different people living inside one body, then I wanted an option they could pick.

[bdot.livejournal.com]

i have run into folks on lj and IRL who believe they are something other than "just human".. and while i identify as "female human" whos to say that the others are wrong!

[pne.livejournal.com]

Exactly.

[timwi.livejournal.com]

I suppose that makes sense, but unfortunately it doesn't change the fact that many people will answer that just to be funny. :/ Of course, that's nothing you can change.

[pne.livejournal.com]

unfortunately it doesn't change the fact that many people will answer that just to be funny.

Yes, unfortunately.

[sparkofcreation.livejournal.com]

1. I use "first name" and "last name" in conversation, but "given name" and "surname" when doing translators' notes.

2. I capitalize my last name when filling out government forms—the US Citizenship & Immigration Services (USCIS) requires it, and so it's become a habit. Especially since if I'm typing on a line, the "p" in my last name tends to look like an "o", and it's hard enough to spell already. (Trust me on that one. Four letters, but impossible to spell.)

3. When I got married, I hyphenated my last name; but mostly I go by just my husband's surname. It's easier (see #2) and prettier.

4. He considered hyphenating his as well. I talked him out of it. (See #2-3.)

Oh, and I now have two given names and a hyphenated last name. Don't know if that counts as 3 or 4 names altogether.

[sparkofcreation.livejournal.com]

BTW in Spanish the word for "name" just means "given name" so we get into a lot of problems with that—not to mention the problems with the double last name!!

[elgrande.livejournal.com]

Interesting. The opposite is true of German, where "Name" on its own, when contrasted with "Vorname", means "last name". Come to think of it, I guess the Spanish meaning has confused me before.

name = given name

[pne.livejournal.com]

Same in Russian, apparently; "imya" is what I'd've translated as "name", but it's apparently also the word used for a given name.

When I asked a co-worker what would appear on a form that asks you to write your name, she said they usually say "FIO" -- an acronym for "Familiya, Imya, Otchestvo" (Family name, given name, patronymic).

[elgrande.livejournal.com]

Am I right in assuming that only native speakers of English are supposed to poll? I'm never really sure when you have polls about English.

So far, I haven't given my opinion in polls of this kind because I don't want you to get a weird or meaningless result.

[elgrande.livejournal.com]

Oh, sorry, I guess the 6th question contains the answer to my question.

[bacskocky.livejournal.com]

Usually, people call me by a nickname (Steph since my name is Stephanie), although the running joke at work is that my name is Sabrina, so I often get called that as well.

My son's name is William, and while I call him William, my grandmother calls him Willy, and people at work call him Billy. His father sometimes calls him Donovan, which is his middle name, but mostly he's William. :)

[node-ue.livejournal.com]

Well, first of all, how the hell are there more people with 2 given names than "at least one"? That is mathematically impossible.

Next: My middle name isn't a saint's name on purpose, but it *is* a saint's name. I said it was.

[pne.livejournal.com]

Next: My middle name isn't a saint's name on purpose, but it *is* a saint's name. I said it was.

The question was intended to be "a saint's name on purpose", but I wasn't very clear about it.

I'll leave it up to you whether to change your answer.

[lukeii.livejournal.com]

I have a fairly interesting story about my name.

My full name is Luke Peter Joseph *surname* (for privacy I will not divulge my surname).

My father's full name was Peter Joseph *surname*

I actually changed my name legally from Luke Peter *surname* to Luke Peter Joseph *surname* to honour my father.

This was after a competition I entered at University, where I was given 1000 points for my team, to change my name legally to the same name as the team.

So for a short time I was named I.I. *surname* as the name of the team I was on was I.I. (We came second in the competition). This also explains my nickname of lukeii

When I wanted to change back, the government said I could not have the same name as before, so I added the middle name of my father.

Hence, my full name is now Luke Peter Joseph *surname*

Thank-you for reading my story! :) I enjoyed taking your poll as I had some strange answers to give.

[pne.livejournal.com]

When I wanted to change back, the government said I could not have the same name as before

Huh! Interesting.

And an interesting story, too.

[yak-boy.livejournal.com]

Just to clarify, when I answered the question "Would you expect your partner to change their family name when they marry you?" and gave the answer "Yes, though I'm not married yet", it is not that I would want to enforce that choice on some hypothetical future spouse, but rather that I am actually engaged and have already discussed this issue with my actual future wife.

It's absolutely her choice, but it is made easier by the fact that she currently has a rather embarassing surname.